Metallic Copper Fountain Pen

[ValleyBoy]

Hi pen people.

Another weekend is upon us and I hope you all get to spend some quality time in your workshops.

I recently bought a box of blanks from a fellow maker who was getting out of the hobby and included within were a couple of extras I wasn’t expecting.

One of them was a rather eye-catching unlabelled blank that was made from real metal (copper) mixed with urethane. I am not 100% sure I’m correct on this but I have come to this conclusion based on the weight of the blank, the smell when turning and the filthy state of my hands after I’d finished turning.

I have a rule that I don’t touch any plastics that are made from urethane or epoxy (such as alumilute) as it simply doesn’t turn or polish anything like the same way as proper acrylic does. I find it quite an unsatisfactory experience all round.

However this blank, due to the high metal content, was different and turned and polished beautifully. So I would happily use it again in that regard, however there was a different issue, which again you rarely get with acrylic, and which means I actually won’t use this again. The dreaded air bubbles.

I know there are many ways you can fix air bubbles by filling to disguise them, or even exaggerating them with a bit of colour etc. However that tends to work better on highly figured blanks, but on something like this with subtle colours and a very shiny finish it’s going to be impossible not to have some sign of the hole remaining. Unless I can get that clever lady off The Repair Shop tv show to fill it and match it exactly. Alas I wish had those skills.

Anyway here it is. As I only had one blank I had to use complimentary finials. The last couple of shots show the air holes which I will attempt to fill at some point. As you’ll see one appeared early on in the process but I decided to fill it with brown CA and plough ahead as I was keen to see the finished pen.

It’s fitted with a Bock No6 nib with my “ready inked” engraving and has silver accents and a chrome clip.

Cheers
Ash

 

[alan morrison]

Now I really really like that, Ash.
Very nice contrasting colours.

 

[ValleyBoy]

Now I really really like that, Ash.
Very nice contrasting colours.

Thanks Alan!

 

[PensFromNo11]

Your posts are always a real education.. other than the obvious - what an incredibly well made pen looks like, colour theory and how to take fantastic photos of your pen (with a phone I think) today I learned not all plastic blanks are equal

 

[Curly]

Great pen as expected.

I would bet money that that blank might have been one of the older M3 blanks. Their Damascus and Mokum Gane blanks look very much like the one you made your pen from. The new owner (Tim Mackenzie that makes the diamond cast blanks) has been playing a lot with it making similar patterns as the M3 blanks were but with better resin. Maybe send him some pictures and perhaps he will try to duplicate it. I know he is on FB or perhaps Phil can put you in touch.

Pete

 

[Bill Mooney]

Another stunner Ash.

 

[flexi]

Plus 1 for M3...Mokum

Very nice as always Ash and I like the pairing you have chosen to accentuate the copper tones....you do get some nice combinations..

 

[Adal6]

Very Nice ash beautiful pens

 

[Curly]

Here is the link to the M3 blanks they have now.

M3 Metal Composite Blanks

** Now Available ** Originally invented by Mike Kogan, the M3 (Macro Molecular Metal) composite is now owned by McKenzie Penworks. This amazing material combines real metals in a resin binder to produce beautiful products that are easy to machine and polish. Our new formulation takes the...

www.mckenziepenworks.com

Nothing like yours yet. Some of them will test the depth of your wallet.

Pete

 

[ValleyBoy]

Here is the link to the M3 blanks they have now.

M3 Metal Composite Blanks

** Now Available ** Originally invented by Mike Kogan, the M3 (Macro Molecular Metal) composite is now owned by McKenzie Penworks. This amazing material combines real metals in a resin binder to produce beautiful products that are easy to machine and polish. Our new formulation takes the...

www.mckenziepenworks.com

Nothing like yours yet. Some of them will test the depth of your wallet.

Pete

Thanks Pete, I appreciate the heads up and yes I think it is the same stuff. Phil does have the exact same blank colour combo available on BI and I’m wondering if the manufacturing/new formulation process may mean it’s improved now that it’s been taken over by a new company.
I still don’t think I’ll be rushing out to buy another as it’s a little bit salty, but no doubt justified by the complex manufacturing. As I say they are really lovely, but once bitten twice shy and all that!
Cheers
Ash

 

[ValleyBoy]

Your posts are always a real education.. other than the obvious - what an incredibly well made pen looks like, colour theory and how to take fantastic photos of your pen (with a phone I think) today I learned not all plastic blanks are equal

That’s kind of you to say. I try to post or respond to posts with the information I wish I’d been told when I was starting out. Most of it is subjective of course but hopefully it comes across as useful rather than preachy.
Cheers
Ash

 

[PensFromNo11]

That’s kind of you to say. I try to post or respond to posts with the information I wish I’d been told when I was starting out. Most of it is subjective of course but hopefully it comes across as useful rather than preachy.
Cheers
Ash

The information you impart is incredibly useful. You can find plenty of stuff on the basics but beyond that it seems a closed shop. I get that for some its a business and don't want to give up 'trade secrets'. Your attitude saves a huge amount of waste stopping us hobbyists plowing down the wrong avenues working stuff out. I do love to work things out, but after the second bag of rubbish unusable bits of plastic and wood its great to be able to ask a question and get a sensible answer. so cheers Ash

 

[howsitwork?]

Ash

if you want to fill it then Robert sorby do or did do copper powder for adding* to their” inlace” resin.

very pleasant lines to that pen , shame as you say about the bubbles

 

[Phil Dart]

Thanks Pete, I appreciate the heads up and yes I think it is the same stuff. Phil does have the exact same blank colour combo available on BI and I’m wondering if the manufacturing/new formulation process may mean it’s improved now that it’s been taken over by a new company.
I still don’t think I’ll be rushing out to buy another as it’s a little bit salty, but no doubt justified by the complex manufacturing. As I say they are really lovely, but once bitten twice shy and all that!
Cheers
Ash

They are a different animal these days from the originals. Tim spent a long time acquiring the skills and techniques to produce them, then spent more time changing the materials so that they no longer suffer from the brittleness and air bubble issues that used to plague them. They ain't cheap though, and they're fairly heavy, but they do make lovely pens, as you've just shown Ash.

 

[sutdm]

HI Ash, as a purchaser of Mckenzie, Hobble creek, Brooks and Lumberjim blanks which i thought were acrylic, i'm now confused by what actual resins are being used in these blanks?
Do you have time to give us a run down on the various actual polymers different brand resins are, which you find best for turning (threading! i don't think all of the issues i have with threading are my fault?) as well as polishing etc.
I have used copper powder to fill in air pockets by packing the powder in dry and then blobbing thin ac on top. I'm sure you've met most techniques in your time so........Grandmother-----eggs.
Thanks in advance for your time and......Happy Christmas!

 

[ValleyBoy]

Hi Mark

First of all I should say that I think of plastics in the same way that I think of wine. It’s a vast subject, that I know very little about, but through lots of dedicated experimenting and trial and error I know the ones I like.

So I am happy to share my experiences, and why I’ve made certain decisions, but I am far from an expert and others may have different opinions (I’m talking about plastic now and not wine).

In terms of threading you will find that the vast majority of the readily available plastic pen blanks are machinable, and the main exception to this is polyester. There may be others too, but polyester is one that I tend to avoid. But you’re safe with most of the others and this includes the two-part epoxy/urethane that the clever folk you’ve mentioned use and mix with dyes and powders to create very distinctive blanks. The most common I see is Alumilite but other brands exist. It all machinable and takes threads really well. (So if you’re struggling then let me know what the issue is and I will try to help).

Incidentally if you go onto Beaufort Ink website and look at the blanks section they very helpfully add a symbol to the top right of the picture to inform you of whether the material takes threads or not.

Anyway the main reason I avoid the alumilite type blanks is more to do with the finishing because when I use my polishing method, (and I stress this is based on my approach to polishing that I don’t want to change and not a criticism of the material itself), I find I can’t get as good a finish on them compared to acrylic. I am guessing that this is because acrylic is harder, and the harder something is, generally speaking, the better it will polish. That’s not to say you can’t get a good polish on alumilite et al, it’s just in my anecdotal side-by-side tests I can’t get it as good. And I find the shine dulls faster too.

Also if you’re using clear/tinted plastic again I would always opt for acrylic because the two part mixes are prone to discolouring and I’ve seen some real horror stories of clear pens turning a nasty yellow or purple colour often in a very short timeframe.

So that’s my opinion, but please take it as just that. An opinion. There are folk on here who know an awful lot about this topic, and may even correct me on one or two things, but I hope you find it useful.

Cheers
Ash

 

[sutdm]

That's brilliant! Thanks very much Ash.
I personally am on an Italian Primitivo kick!
Wrt the alumilite blanks, i've certainly enjoyed turning the material and it seems to thread ok, the main issue seems to be chipping (this after turning the blank down to D minus a gnats crotchet and following the advice i can find but that seems to happen with some of the harder materials so i guess that's hardly surprising.
What are the brands of blanks that are genuine acrylic resin?
Thanks again in advance.
Mark

 

[ValleyBoy]

My pleasure Mark.

In terms if the chipping you mention is that happening as you turn the stuff or during the threading? (I’m assuming your using taps and dies).

In terms of “acrylic” blanks, (I suspect the word may be used somewhat generically to describe a variety of plastics under a similar umbrella), there are lots of them about, but if I was starting out right now the best advice I would give myself is to get hold of some kirinite. If you search for it you’ll see lots of uk based sellers such as Beaufort, Turners Workshop and others. It is wonderful stuff and it’s relatively inexpensive. It also machines and polishes beautifully so I’d get a few of those and try them out.

I say that because it’s a good product to benchmark against because if, for example, you find they are also chipping when you’re turning then something is amiss and it isn’t the material (I’ve used several kilometres of the stuff over the years and never had a single bubble or brittle blank). So you can remove the material related possibilities and it may be that the tool isn’t sharp enough or maybe you’re applying a touch too much pressure etc.

Cheers
Ash

 

[sutdm]

i
Thanks for the info. That is gold dust!
The chipping im getting is all when i'm threading. Very little chipping whith M10x1 or M10x.75 Mostly with the Beaufort Ink supplied three start cap threading die. I don't believe the die is blunt or defective. I've got some indeterminate black resin which i use for insert tenons etc and they chip far worse than the alumilite. When you say applying too much pressure are you talking about sideways pressure on the die to keep it cutting (i've managed to strip a tenon entirely when not applying enough sideways pressure so i could be going too far the other way i guess).
Do you have a go to youtube video guide person who gives good tutorials i could have a look at? Might save you being endlessly brain picked
.
Once again, thank you for your patience.

 

[Curly]

sutdm what diameter are your tenons that you are threading? If at the full 10mm it may be the reason for your issues. If at 9.9mm or 9.8mm then it may be something else. You are using a threading lubricant of some sort aren't you?

Pete